Urdu: ہم نو بجے گھر واپس آئیں ہیں

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Stranger_

Senior Member
Persian
Dear friends, would you be so kind and translate the following sentence as literally as possible?

ہم نو بجے گھر واپس آئیں ہیں ، کھانا کھایا ہے

That [ہیں] after [آئیں] is the real culprit here; for I have not yet come across this kind of a structure. I am aware of the usage of '-en(ge)' which indicates the possibility of something but here it is followed by [ہیں] which makes the sentence in present perfect tense. So, what could it possibly mean?

Do let me know if you should need further context.

Best regards,
RF
 
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  • Qureshpor

    Senior Member
    Panjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    ^ In your sentence, according to chaste standard Urdu, two verbal nasals showing plurality can not co-exist. The sentence should be..

    ham nau baje ghar vaapas aa'e haiN, khaanaa khaayaa hai...

    We (have) returned home at nine o' clock, have had our meal...

    This topic of two nasals occurring together has been discussed before. If I find it, I'll edit my message and add that thread link.
     

    marrish

    Senior Member
    اُردو Urdu
    ^ In your sentence, according to chaste standard Urdu, two verbal nasals showing plurality can not co-exist. The sentence should be..

    ham nau baje ghar vaapas aa'e haiN, khaanaa khaayaa hai...

    We (have) returned home at nine o' clock, have had our meal...

    This topic of two nasals occurring together has been discussed before. If I find it, I'll edit my message and add that thread link.
    You are right on the rule but there is another way of reading the sentence as it is:

    ham nau baje ghar vaapas aa'iiN haiN... which should be ham nau baje ghar vaapas aa'ii haiN.

    Of course in English the translation will remain the same :)
     

    Qureshpor

    Senior Member
    Panjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    You are right on the rule but there is another way of reading the sentence as it is:

    ham nau baje ghar vaapas aa'iiN haiN... which should be ham nau baje ghar vaapas aa'ii haiN.

    Of course in English the translation will remain the same :)
    Apologies for looking at this with male brain cells! I will try harder next time to avoid this kind of error.:)
     

    Qureshpor

    Senior Member
    Panjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    You are right on the rule but there is another way of reading the sentence as it is:

    ham nau baje ghar vaapas aa'iiN haiN... which should be ham nau baje ghar vaapas aa'ii haiN.

    Of course in English the translation will remain the same :)
    Apparently for Delhi Urdu, the femine plural is the same as masculine plural.

    In Urdu zabaan-o-qavaa3id by Shafi Ahmed Siddiqui, thr following two sentences are given.

    ustaaniyoN ne kahaa ham abhii aatii haiN - wrong

    ustaaniyoN ne kahaa ham abhii aate haiN - correct!
     

    marrish

    Senior Member
    اُردو Urdu
    Apparently for Delhi Urdu, the femine plural is the same as masculine plural.

    In Urdu zabaan-o-qavaa3id by Shafi Ahmed Siddiqui, thr following two sentences are given.

    ustaaniyoN ne kahaa ham abhii aatii haiN - wrong

    ustaaniyoN ne kahaa ham abhii aate haiN - correct!
    I wholeheartedly agree and I would say that this should be taken as a rule for idiomatic Urdu and I've heard it, even outside the Delhi Urdu context, uttered by respectable ladies often enough for me to be able to vouch for it. I presume Hyderabadi (Dakkani) observes the same phenomenon (with the exception ham->appan)

    The meaning of my previous post finally deciphered!
     

    aevynn

    Senior Member
    USA
    English, Hindustani
    Yep, I too can vouch for this outside of Delhi! Some people I know from Chandigarh use the -e endings for feminine plurals/honorifics very regularly. Things like: maamii jii bhii aaeNge.
     

    Qureshpor

    Senior Member
    Panjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    Yep, I too can vouch for this outside of Delhi! Some people I know from Chandigarh use the -e endings for feminine plurals/honorifics very regularly. Things like: maamii jii bhii aaeNge.
    I understand that as far as Urdu is concerned, only 1st person plural can take masculine verb endings.
     

    aevynn

    Senior Member
    USA
    English, Hindustani
    Apparently for Delhi Urdu, the femine plural is the same as masculine plural.
    A literary example of the -e verb ending being used in a feminine plural context caught my eye as I was re-reading Lihaaf by Ismat Chughtai (who grew up in UP). Note that the narrator of the story typically uses -ii verb endings for herself and -ii(N) endings for begam jaan.

    das-gyaarah baje tak to baateN karte rahe, maiN aur begam jaan taash khelte rahe...​
     
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