Hindi/Urdu: andaaza karnaa/lagaanaa

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eskandar

Moderator
English (US)
I understand both of these terms (andaaza karnaa and andaaza lagaana) to mean "to guess." Is there a difference between them, however subtle? Contexts where you might use one or the other?
 
  • littlepond

    Senior Member
    Hindi
    I would only use "andaazaa lagaanaa" in Hindi: I have personally never heard of "andaazaa karnaa", which sounds very unwieldy.
     

    eskandar

    Moderator
    English (US)
    That was my sense as well, I had only heard (and said) andaaza lagaanaa before, but I came across it in a speech Abul Kalam Azad gave in the Lok Sabha (June 16, 1952), in which he said aap andaaza kar sakte haiN kih parsoN jab ek ke ba'd ek honorable member uThe aur...
    This use (andaaza karnaa) is also recorded in Platts, for what it's worth.
     

    desi4life

    Senior Member
    English
    “andaazaa karnaa” is also mentioned in McGregor’s Hindi-English dictionary and searching online for “अंदाजा करके”, for example, shows that this construction is in use. However, it seems to be less common than “andaazaa lagaanaa”.
     

    littlepond

    Senior Member
    Hindi
    ... I came across it in a speech Abul Kalam Azad gave in the Lok Sabha (June 16, 1952), in which he said aap andaaza kar sakte haiN kih parsoN jab ek ke ba'd ek honorable member uThe aur...
    It seems to be completely synonymous to "andaazaa lagaa sakte haiN".
     

    eskandar

    Moderator
    English (US)
    Good to know that there is no difference between the two, and that it wasn't just me (the non-native learner) who hadn't encountered andaaza karnaa before. Thanks for confirming.
     

    littlepond

    Senior Member
    Hindi
    My pleasure! Note that "andaazaa lagaanaa" means "to infer" more than "to guess"; of course, in some situations, there could be an overlap. "To guess" is otherwise mostly (at least in Hindi) "tukkaa lagaanaa" or "tukkaa maarnaa".
     

    Qureshpor

    Senior Member
    Panjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    I understand both of these terms (andaaza karnaa and andaaza lagaana) to mean "to guess." Is there a difference between them, however subtle? Contexts where you might use one or the other?
    eskandar SaaHib, an interesting question. As the forum Moderators habitually ask for an appropriate context for queries posted here, could you please provide suitable contexts for both Urdu and Hindi, preferably from literary sources, quoting both "andaazah karnaa/lagaanaa" in the case of Urdu and "andaazaa karnaa/lagaanaa" for Hindi. This will help respondents in deciding whatever subtle difference, if any, there is in each language between both usages.
     
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    Qureshpor

    Senior Member
    Panjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    ......This use (andaaza karnaa) is also recorded in Platts, for what it's worth.
    I would say its worth its weight in gold!

    “The fact is, I have for many years been engaged in the study of Urdu and Hindi books (in prose and verse) and newspapers with the view of collecting words and phrases for this work. I have thus been enabled, not only to verify most of the words given in the Dictionaries of Shakespeare and others, but to supplement them with thousands of new words and phrases and additional meanings of words. Moreover, a long residence in India made me acquainted with much of the living colloquial language not found in Dictionaries which I was careful to note.” Preface to Platts “A Dictionary of Urdu, Classical Hindi and English”. 1884

    “The earliest in the series was John Fergusan's 'A Dictionary of Hindustani language' which was published in London in 1773 A. D. Among others 'A Dictionary : Hindustanee and English, Calcutta, 1808 (Taylor)', 'A Dictionary : Hindustani and English, London, 1817 (Shakespeare)', 'A Dictionary : Hindustani and English, London, 1848 (Duncan Forbes)' and 'A Dictionary of Urdu, Classical Hindi and English, London, 1884 (Platts)' deserve special mention. The last mentioned work is, undoubtedly, the best of the whole lot.” (From preface to A Prctical Hindi-English Dictionary-Caturvedi
     

    eskandar

    Moderator
    English (US)
    In addition to the Abul Kalam Azad speech I quoted above in post #3, I came across andaaza karnaa again in an Urdu short story by Krishan Chandar, "Do farlaang lambii saRak": "mujhe kitnii Khoshii haasil ho gii - is kaa ko'ii andaaza nahiiN kar saktaa." In both cases the verb is used together with saknaa. Is it possible that the usual verb is andaaza lagaanaa but that it is changed in this construction because andaaza kar saknaa sounds better than andaaza lagaa saknaa ?
     

    littlepond

    Senior Member
    Hindi
    Is it possible that the usual verb is andaaza lagaanaa but that it is changed in this construction because andaaza kar saknaa sounds better than andaaza lagaa saknaa ?
    andaaza lagaa saknaa sounds great! It is andaaza kar saknaa that always would sound worse to many ears, since one "lagaa" - "fixes" - things like a guess, an estimate, a quickfix solution, etc., in the Hindi-speaking consciousness at least, rather than "does". Similarly, while "anumaan karnaa" exists, "anumaan lagaanaa" sounds better. Similarly, "pech lagaanaa" (in fact, "pech karnaa" means the contrary!).
     

    Qureshpor

    Senior Member
    Panjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    In addition to the Abul Kalam Azad speech I quoted above in post #3, I came across andaaza karnaa again in an Urdu short story by Krishan Chandar, "Do farlaang lambii saRak": "mujhe kitnii Khoshii haasil ho gii - is kaa ko'ii andaaza nahiiN kar saktaa." In both cases the verb is used together with saknaa. Is it possible that the usual verb is andaaza lagaanaa but that it is changed in this construction because andaaza kar saknaa sounds better than andaaza lagaa saknaa ?
    As littlepond has indicated, "andaazah kar saknaa" is equally as good as "andaazah lagaa saknaa".

    From an Urdu perspective.

    اور اس نے زمین میں اوپر سے پہاڑ رکھے اور اس میں برکت دی اور چار دن میں اس کی غذاؤں کا اندازہ کیا (یہ جواب) پوچھنے والوں کے لیے پورا ہے۔

    Ahmed Ali- Surah Fussilat [41]- verse 10 (The translator Ahmed Ali 1910-1994)

    dil ke maHbas meN kareN zaat kaa maatam kab tak
    aa’o baahar to chaleN vaqt kaa andaazah kareN

    Shamsur Rahman Faruqi (Urdu critic and poet)

    huuN apnii zindagii kaa andaazah karne vaalaa
    jannat se laa ke tuu ne dozax meN mujh ko Daalaa

    Aziz Lakhnavi (died 1935)

    Ghulami meN nah kaam aatii haiN shamshiireN nah tadbiireN
    Jo ho zauq-i-yaqiiN paidaa to kaT jaatii haiN zanjiireN
    ko’ii andaazah kar saktaa hai us ke zor-i-baazuu kaa
    nigaah-i-momin se badal jaatii haiN taqdiireN

    Iqbal (died 1938- From tuluu3-i-Islam -baaNg-i-daraa 1924)

    dukh apnaa agar ham ko bataanaa nahiiN aataa
    tum ko bhii to andaazah lagaanaa nahiiN aataa

    Waseem Barelvi

    It appears that "andaazah karnaa" is the original verb while "andaazah lagaanaa" is of more recent vintage. Both the persons cited were from an Urdu background -Maulana Abul Kalam Azad- an Urdu speaker and writer and Krishan Chandar, an Urdu writer.
     
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